The Goosing Of Marvel NOW With Variants And Discount

[paulski]

Great article, Rich - agree with virtually every word.

And thank you for keeping Gabriel honest with all the bulldust he was spinning...

[Blade X]

Bob, content is not the main problem. If there were some magic content formula that would sell, do you not think at least a few of the 130 indy titles a month would regularly be topping the 100K league? Because they can do any damn content they choose to.

Content might not be THE MAIN problem, but it is ONE OF SEVERAL reasons why MARVEL NOW (so far) isn't selling so well in stores. As for the content in Indy books, you do realize that brand recognition is everything and that in the very insular (and shrinking) current comic book market, the most recognizable and popular comic book brands among the current readership are Marvel and DC superhero comics. Most (not all) Indy comics (regardless of content) are neither popular recognizable brands among the current fanbase.

Varied content, more diversity, Hell yeah, I'd love to see some. But digital also makes it less expensive, and therefore less of a gamble, to try throwing 'new' ideas at the wall to see what happens...

Digital might be cheaper and less expensive when it comes to printing and distribution costs, but it would still be expensive in regards to creative costs. Also, going digital cuts out the collector,completist,and speculator buyers (the latter I'll be happy to see go) which are very essential to the Big 2's business. The Obama issue of ASM and the issue of CAPTAIN AMERICA where Cap "died" would not have no where near as well as they did if those books were only available digitally. Most (not all) of the people who bought those books cared less about reading those books and cared more about making money off of a collectable comic.

[Blade X]

There may well be a degree of good customer relations involved, though perhaps not outright philanthropy...

Speaking only for te shop I work at, we don't order extra copies of a comic in order to get a special variant cover (even if we know that one of our customers want a variant cover). We order what we can sell, and if we happen to get a variant cover then we either sell it (at cover price) to one of our customers who buys variants or rack the book with the regular issues (at cover price).

But presumably retailers are also making money from this course of action too?

Cheers

Assuming, of course, that they actually manage to sell the damn things.

[Blade X]

The really, really annoying/heart-breaking thing to me is that the super-hero comic buying customer base is so damn small that at least doubling it on the back of things like the Avengers movie should not be a particularly difficult task....

Cheers

Maybe if Marvel (a) would stop telling "new" stories that are basically a retelling of the movie story (which in itself, is a retelling of an old comic story) (b) actually make the comics accessible to a wide all ages audience of old,lapse,and new readers (c) embrace the comic book universe instead of the movie universe and (d) stop telling WHAT IF and fan fiction stories set in the regular continuity, then the books MIGHT actually start to sell better. Notice that the only book that the AVENGERS movie succeeded in boosting sales on was was the (I think) was the tpb of the very accessible and self contained ALL AGES INFINITY GAUNTLET mini series from 20 years ago. Of course the current editorial regime and creative people in control of Marvel (as well as many fans) can't seem to realize (or refuses to admit) that there is a huge audience for straightforward true all ages superhero comics.

[Peter J Poole]

Content might not be THE MAIN problem, but it is ONE OF SEVERAL reasons why MARVEL NOW (so far) isn't selling so well in stores. As for the content in Indy books, you do realize that brand recognition is everything and that in the very insular (and shrinking) current comic book market, the most recognizable and popular comic book brands among the current readership are Marvel and DC superhero comics. Most (not all) Indy comics (regardless of content) are neither popular recognizable brands among the current fanbase.

So you either have people already buying books who will buy Big Two comics whatever the content is like and won't even look at stuff from other publisher, or people who prefer Big Two to all others. Neither of whom would seem likely to jump ship or take on extra passengers however much people change the content.

And a world of millions outside who will not even look at comics to decide on content.

Plus - some - retailers who are happy enough to stick to the Big Two for bread and butter while bitching about them every hour, on the hour, and doing sod all to promote any alternatives within their customer base and double sod all to promote anything at all outside the customer base...

Digital might be cheaper and less expensive when it comes to printing and distribution costs, but it would still be expensive in regards to creative costs. Also, going digital cuts out the collector,completist,and speculator buyers (the latter I'll be happy to see go) which are very essential to the Big 2's business. The Obama issue of ASM and the issue of CAPTAIN AMERICA where Cap "died" would not have no where near as well as they did if those books were only available digitally. Most (not all) of the people who bought those books cared less about reading those books and cared more about making money off of a collectable comic.

You're talking about digital as a simple replacement for the DM/LCS deal. Which would be bad for the LCS.

But using digital for a weekly drop of comics for people who just want to read them, with a limited variant/trade collection product stream sold through the LCS so that completists can be happy and speculators can buy things rare enough that they may actually increase in value is a winner all round...

Cheers

[Peter J Poole]

Assuming, of course, that they actually manage to sell the damn things.

Because that's an incredibly rare objective in any retail endeavour...

Cheers

[Peter J Poole]

Maybe if Marvel (a) would stop telling "new" stories that are basically a retelling of the movie story (which in itself, is a retelling of an old comic story) (b) actually make the comics accessible to a wide all ages audience of old,lapse,and new readers (c) embrace the comic book universe instead of the movie universe and (d) stop telling WHAT IF and fan fiction stories set in the regular continuity, then the books MIGHT actually start to sell better. Notice that the only book that the AVENGERS movie succeeded in boosting sales on was was the (I think) was the tpb of the very accessible and self contained ALL AGES INFINITY GAUNTLET mini series from 20 years ago. Of course the current editorial regime and creative people in control of Marvel (as well as many fans) can't seem to realize (or refuses to admit) that there is a huge audience for straightforward true all ages superhero comics.

Groan...

They're only retellings if people have read the original story. We can't look at genuinely new readers and expect them to have the same knowledge, expectations and reactions as us long term inmates do...

All ages is too big a gamble as a straight replacement. Three strands, 7-12, 12-16, 17 and up.

And spend real money to promote the bejasus out of all of them.

You know the counter arguments to your cry for all ages, Ghod knows people have presented them often enough in here!

Embracing a universe - which changes every decade or so anyway - known to a couple of hundred thousand people or embrace one known to millions... hmmm, tough call...

The best solution I saw was Fraction's run on Iron Man, from Five Nightmares onwards... a take that was equally accessible to both camps.

Cheers

[Stephen Wacker]

Speaking only for te shop I work at,

Bwahahahahah!!!

Lest anyone think "Blade X" works in (or as he used to claim "owns") a comic store..this lie has been debunked many, many times.

SW

[ewokpelts]

BUT the problem is the order levels are insanely high as to be prohibitive. Nobody wins if the price of getting the incentive is too high to reach. That was the genius of DC using returnabilty to get more copies in the shops without threatening to put the store out of business. If I had tried to hit my target numbers on Uncanny Avengers, I'd be staring at a stack of at least 70 extra regular copies and who knows how many variants... Well over $200 in unsellable stock rotting in a box. No thank you.

one little tip i remember back in the day. if you DONATE books to charity or hospitals/ect, you can write off your taxes the full cover price of each issue donated.
not a bad way to kill off unsold stock

[Blade X]

So you either have people already buying books who will buy Big Two comics whatever the content is like and won't even look at stuff from other publisher, or people who prefer Big Two to all others. Neither of whom would seem likely to jump ship or take on extra passengers however much people change the content.

I don't want anyone to "jump ship". If the content of the Big 2 comics is changed then they MIGHT be able to attract new and lapse readers as well as keep existing readers, and as a result, increase sales for the long term.

And a world of millions outside who will not even look at comics to decide on content.

And yet, this has been the audience that Marvel (and DC) have been aiming the over whelming majority of their books at over the last 12 years and why they change their comics to reflect the movie and TV versions of the characters.

Plus - some - retailers who are happy enough to stick to the Big Two for bread and butter while bitching about them every hour, on the hour, and doing sod all to promote any alternatives within their customer base and double sod all to promote anything at all outside the customer base...

Just because we depend on the Big 2 for our 'bread and butter" does not mean that we (a) can't complain about their policies and the content of their comics and (b) have to promote alternative publishers and comics to our customers.

You're talking about digital as a simple replacement for the DM/LCS deal. Which would be bad for the LCS.

I thought that was what you were talking about. My bad.

But using digital for a weekly drop of comics for people who just want to read them, with a limited variant/trade collection product stream sold through the LCS so that completists can be happy and speculators can buy things rare enough that they may actually increase in value is a winner all round...

Cheers

That's kind of what DC us currently doing with the BATMAN BEYOND UNLIMITED comic. So I have no problem with this.